NO LONGER Trying to get YAMAHA to produce more ealy RZ tanks

[JonW]

ORIGINAL IDEA PROVEN A NON STARTER DUE TO LACK OF SUPPORT, HOWEVER THIS THREAD DOES GET INTERESTING ON PG2 WITH AN ALLOY TANK ETC.

[S]I am trying to show Yamaha that it is worth their while to produce more of the 83-85 tanks. At this time I am not trying for anything else. I wouldn't do this if I felt it was a waste of time, so please no negativity about this. Anyway, if you want to support it, please go here:

http://www.rzrd500.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10430

If you want to pass it on to the other forums, please do so, I do not post everywhere...[/S]

[2TInstitute]

A few things why do you want Yamaha to do this? Then you would have to look at it from Yamaha's perpective what is in it for them? Then present them with a viable business case to get it happening. One thing I would do would be contact Ferry Brouwer and ask how he convinced Yamaha to start making TZ350 piston again and follow his lead.

Next I would say get a good tank and 3D scan it and have a proper .IGES file made. ANYONE could achine stamping dies from that. There is a company in Taiwan that has a copy service that's where I would be going.

[JonW]

Did you read the thread I linked Lozza? Most of what you asked is there. I will not do a full biz case until the end but the gist is up there.

Cheers for the heads up on Ferry Brouwer etc.

[2TInstitute]

I read it and first thing is there is a lot of work for Yamaha with precious little return.Good will doesn't pay the bills. There are VERY few companies that still support old products, Porsche being about the only one.
You would be better to just ask for the drawings and see if you could make them under licence.
Biggest hurdle you have is this.
Is what it would cost Yamaha to stop production of the latest scooter tanks and tool up and start making RZ tanks. Making and selling scooter in Indonesia is what keeps Yamaha afloat (why JL has all that Indo written on his leathers). Yamaha would probably love to do it but they won't if the numbers don't add up.
Assuming Yamaha said yes, and the MOQ is 100 with a unit cost of $100 + the shipping and import duty someone will have to look at stumping up $15k and store 5 pallets of tanks. Then the hassle of packaging and shipping them worldwide.
Then you have to deal with 100 customers in 20 countries.
I dunno if that's being negative or realistic, best bloke to ask would be that Gus fellow who got the RZ500 cranks remanufactured.

[JonW]

To be honest everyone just seems to want to say it cant be done. I was really just trying to gauge interest (potential market) and see what the lie of the land was, with nothing in it for me other than hard work.

I deliberately wanted people to look on this for its potential and not worry about the other stuff, hence the no-negativity comment. Every forum I put this on has people worrying about the ins and outs rather than getting their name on the thread.

I guess that means we now know that people don't want them made. I can read that as 'the market is too small', now we know.

I'll spend my time looking for a good used tank instead. Anyone got one?

[OzzyElsie]

Isn't there an Indian company re-manufacturing RZ tanks?

(If Ma Yama was to remake a tank I would have thought it would be the LC's )

Talking of........there was a pommy firm making alloy LC tanks for around $500. Maybe they could do the same for RZ's.)

[JonW]

The indian tank is crappy.

Maybe thats what they will do, who knows.

Legend. He stopped as no one bought one. But, it was the uk market, there are more used tanks there... and his was not a full copy So no one bought.

Anyone got a good used tank to sell me?

[2TInstitute]

What I'm trying to get across is making the tank is the easy bit, it's everything else that goes with it where the problems lie.
I think Gus sold all his cranks but he had them sitting there, if you had 100 tanks you would 'eventualy' sell them all no doubt about it.
I would still say have a tank 3D scanned, you could CNC rout a wooden 'buck' off which many many tanks could be made.

[sunsetrider02]

I think that Yamaha would marvel in the fact these old bikes are still so popular....but the reality of them putting a production line in place for a small market is very unlikely. At the very best thay might consider offloading production to a Chinese or Taiwanese third party for manufacturing.
Perhaps the best option is the last one being getting a mold made from a 3D image/scan. Getting someone with enough ability to make the tank from the mold may be hard....but do able. Question would still be at what cost!!!!

[OzzyElsie]

Coincidentally I just came across the Indian seller;

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-YAMAHA-R ... 337fe68c16

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-YAMAHA-R ... 4ab652fd65

They have both the RZ and the LC - but you say they are crappy. That's disappointing. I can see a $1000 been put in to a tank with painting and fittings etc etc, and it would be pretty disappointing to have rust appearing through after 12 months or so.

Or after all that time, effort and mulla to have obvious imperfections.

I also think that the $340 plus $120 is absolutely Top Dollar as an asking price, on both accounts. I suss that someone is profiteering - and it won't be the workers .

Here's a Benelli Mojave tank.....

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-BENELLI- ... 3384fa25e8

.......similar size, weight and complexity. But only $250 to buy and $90 to post.

I suss a bit of negotiating may result in a price drop.

What are the known issues with the Indian tanks? Maybe negotiating with this manufacturer for improvement might be more fruitful. (India is currently sliding into recession which might be a 'bur under the saddle' to them.)

Ditto the painting. I'm surprise that this seller doesn't offer a painting service. He seems to be right into the resto market and I would have thought with the cheap labour and a desire to work/survive that a labour intensive service such as painting could be a win win proposal. Again, might be worth the ask.

[DuncanB]

I have one of those tanks, the LC one, in my shed... I sent them a pretty much beyond repair tank for them to use as a pattern. In exchange they sent me a tank. It won't be going on my rebuild lets say!

The basic problems are:
It's handmade, and looks that way. It's not quite symetrical, the welds are a bit rough etc etc.
It's slighty bigger, sits higher than it should, though it's mainly the brackets inside that need moving/replacing as the are a bit shit.
It weighs a couple of KG's more than is should, not neccessarily a problem as no doubt most of us do...
So if your bike was a commuter/rat bike you wouldn't give a toss and it could be made to work, though at $460 would be a pricey bit of gear.
To make it look like it should for a bike as superb as an LC, it would require that much work it makes it an unrealistic option.

To rate it in terms of a percentage it is maybe 50% right... with more effort they could possibly improve the thing. I should in reality, give them the necessary feedback, but after trying it on the frame, which still had no forks, seat etc I put it back in the shed with a view to digging it back out when the bike was a bit more complete. (my build is hampered by life/business/etc etc)
You wouldn't want it painted, Ozzie... needs a bit of bog yet!

So there you go... Hope this helps.

[sunsetrider02]

pretty spot on with similar experience in Sydney. It is ok as shear desperation...but not for a resto.

How did you go with a tank for your bike?

[sunsetrider02]

pretty spot on with similar experience in Sydney. It is ok as shear desperation...but not for a resto.

How did you go with a tank for your bike?

[DuncanB]

G'day Phil,

I'm thinking I'll take the tank that came with the bike to a repair place in Brisbane... They dip/clean/weld/braize/solder as necessary. Than I'll seal the inside. It's not that bad, just the bottom around the tap and seam as a few small holes.

[sunsetrider02]

I think tthat is the best pption...at least you know what you will have. I did much the same but mine required ta new fuel intake sout being grafted into the tank as the original was knacked and would nor seal properly. The all up cost was $1200.painted including the side covers annd front guard. Some may find it on the expensive side....but it waz worth it in the end and I am happy with it.