Steering Head Bearings All Balls Vs Pyramid

Greasemeup · Post by **Greasemeup** » Fri Oct 10, 2014 11:38 pm

Hi All,

I purchased 3 sets of bearings off ebay recently from different suppliers.

All are tapered steering head bearings for RZ350

Prices including delivery in AUD
Quadboss $53.55 out of USA

Pyramid $37.99 out of NZ methinks?

All Balls $64.80 Aussie seller.

Below is a few pictures and a short video, make up your own mind on value for money.

The Pyramid seals are marked "CLARK SEALS"

All Balls & Quad Boss are both All Balls bearings
Seals are marked "D8146 & TTO"

And a little low quality video which says it all about manufacturing tolerances.

Note the sound difference when spinning the bearings on the table, this translates to the feel as well, there is a marked difference in smoothness of operation.

I hope this info is helpful in making an informed choice.

GMU..

BRG1200 · Post by **BRG1200** » Sun Oct 12, 2014 10:22 am

Well, I got All Balls, I guess that was a good thing then!

jools · Post by **jools** » Sun Oct 12, 2014 12:19 pm

Pretty hard to make any judgement from the video, all we can hear is the scraping of the bearing on the table surface. I have had trouble with some Pyramid fork seals in the past, but it may just have been a bad batch so I wouldn't want to can them totally, just be aware.

Greasemeup · Post by **Greasemeup** » Sun Oct 12, 2014 6:34 pm

When I flipped them both over the Pyramid inner was scraping on the table so extra noise there, it wouldn't really spin at all.

Before I flipped them, the noise difference, amplified by the kitchen table, is just within the bearing.

The Pyramid was much courser, and allowed a fair bit of side to side movement.

Apparent quality difference in cage per photo.

Difference in gaps between inner & outer races and thickness of those.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

JonW · Post by **JonW** » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:27 pm

I do wonder if Pyramid have different manufacturers for sourcing their stuff as Ive done a similar test before and was convinced they were actually the same product from the same factory, even the packaging is spookily similar etc.

But I do believe you and think the bearing you have isnt very good. maybe contact them and see what they say?

DuncanB · Post by **DuncanB** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:33 am

I bought some fork dust seals from Pyramid and they were shite. That was enough to put me off buying owt else from them!
The little tube of rubber grease that came with em seemed OK though

DOC03 · Post by **DOC03** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 9:53 am

That's pretty much exactly the situation i found, All Balls were tighter and Pyramid seemed generally looser and cheaper quality.
Jon you may be right in that the last few orders of Pyramid stuff I have got seem to be from different manufacturers however, in short I am only using if I cannot find any alternatives for the bearing needed.

JonW · Post by **JonW** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:45 am

Pyramid are large enough to multisource so I guess that does make sense in many ways. They also sourced (from stock) a set of bearings for my KTM Duke 2 and they were smooth as silk, tho I have had issues and the MT250 ones they sent (twice) were totally wrong sizes, and they couldnt supply the correct size after I did a good measure. I also just fitted RZ head bearings to James' bike and they were not sloppy at all when we tried them out of the packet, but they were bought about 2years back. Bike handled superbly and way better than the tired ball n cups he had in there as well.

It could also be that Pyramid are sourcing cheaper now and using less good parts, which would be right considering the info we have here. I would certainly contact Pyramid and see what their response was re the bearing in the video, if they think that's ok, then we at least know their standards are very low now compared to what they used to do.

Ive also had no issue with Pyramid seals... its a bizarre world. :/ On the bike forums there are plenty of war stories of bad aftermarket seals and even some OEM ones have failed even when people have stressed that you cannot / should not fit anything but OEM. Seems they are pernickety things and wear in the forks, pitting and fitting can affect them...

BRG1200 · Post by **BRG1200** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 2:57 pm

Only anecdotal and personal experience, but I'd try to avoid anything "rubber" not from the manufacturer, or at the very least a "reputable" supplier with a proven track record.
Seems to be a continual bugbear, people finding weak, inaccurate, soft or ill fitting parts.

jools · Post by **jools** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:10 pm

I can only say that with the Pyramid fork seals that failed me, I had been meticulous in prep, checked tube diameters to spec, no pitting at all. The rubber of the seals appeared to be more 'plasticy' than I'd expect.

JonW · Post by **JonW** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:27 pm

Wasnt suggesting anyone did anything wrong, just that fork seals are funny things it seems. I bought OEM KTM seals, they didnt fit on one side at all, the the old non OEM ones did and were ok that side... weird.

Yes, and lets not mention Yambits crank seals for the RZ....

JonW · Post by **JonW** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:31 pm

Looking at a thread on rdrz500 forum and this was said:

"Hey if the fork seals in your LC are leaking it's because they are the OEMs. I can't remember if I replaced the OEMs on your bike, but I know a brand new set of frickin expensive OEMs leaked instantly. I buy nothing but Pyramid seals now, 3 sets and haven't had an issue, plus you can buy 4 sets for the price of the OEMs. Just sayin."

Like i said, its a funny world... YMMV etc.

ritza · Post by **ritza** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:11 pm

this is a bit timely for me as i have just replaced the headstem bearing in the tdr over the w/e...the pyamid bearing set was of very ordinary quality both straight out of the packet and when loaded with lots of grease not the piss fart tube they supply...wont buy them again...they had no markings on them at all....i shall see what it rides like...mike

DirtJumperUK · Post by **DirtJumperUK** » Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:02 pm

We have been using Pyramid and all Balls for years, back in 2017 Pyramid upgraded all of their bearing kits to Jap bearings that is when we changed fully to Pyramid, quality went up 100% (as did the price) but well worth the upgrade! AllBalls are still OK but the Korean bearings are no way as smooth and last about 1/3rd of the time.

JonW · Post by **JonW** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:56 am

Interesting as this thread was from 2014 and if Pyramid upgraded in 2017 that would defo make this thread outdated.

Id be interested to try a set again in the RZ/LC sizes, so will look for some and report back as I have a set of all balls here etc.

EDITED: I looked and cant find any for sensible money, like is said above, the price of Pyramid's parts has increased rather a lot since Ive been buying their stuff. Naturally, its worth it if the quality is upped tho of course...

2 Strokes Down Under