Ignition - RD350LC

[OzzyElsie]

Okay, ya got me thinking . Whats the great advantage of a new ignition for the LC. Specifically the Zeeltronic programmable CDI.

I have heard wraps for them but I'm not 100% sure of the big advantage, or more specifically, how the advantage is gained.

I don't consider I have a pressing need to change but I'm always grateful for having an 'edge', especially if the 'edge' is simply and cheaply achieved.

At $250-300 I don't consider Zeeltronics cheap, although reasonable if there is a tangible advantage.

I was thinking the next mod I was going to do to the LC was to lathe the ignition rotor to save some weight so it would spin up faster. Or replace it with a light weight ignition complete (if there is one available - racing Banshee???).

[2TInstitute]

I just typed the same thing elsewhere, engines that 'spin up' faster don't make any more HP, that and light rotors loose rpm as fast as they gain it. Just the thing you don't want for a road bike(or a race bike)
With the ignition the Yamaha parralel twins run a waisted spark swapping to a 2 pick up 2 coil 1 lobe arrangement with gain 3-4HP alone, but you probably won't fit 2 pick ups in the standard cases.If you continue to run the 1 pick up 2 lobe ignitionyou might get a 1-2HP gain (across the range), big adantage is tailoring your ignition to the engine.
For instance ditched a waisted spark setup , changed to 2 pick ups, 2 coils gained 4-6HP 3ft/lbs torq across the range, even better was bad had untill 11,500 over rev

[OzzyElsie]

So, does a Zeeltronic use two coils or a wasted spark?

[2TInstitute]

The model specific unit runs the waisted spark there are other units that are 2 pick up 2 coil.

[OzzyElsie]

...... engines that 'spin up' faster don't make any more HP, that and light rotors loose rpm as fast as they gain it. Just the thing you don't want for a road bike(or a race bike)

I'm well aware of the characteristics but would disagree with your conclusion " that it is a characteristic you don't want for a road bike (or a race bike)". While I would agree that a balance is needed and that the compromise struck for a street bike would err towards the heavier flywheel, a lighter flywheel (indeed all rotating mass) will change the feel and character of the vehicle and accelerate the vehicle faster.

If the LC needs it or not is another matter. I haven't decided to do it yet but I think it would be an interesting (and cheap?) 'tinker'.

With the ignition the Yamaha parralel twins run a waisted spark swapping to a 2 pick up 2 coil 1 lobe arrangement with gain 3-4HP alone, but you probably won't fit 2 pick ups in the standard cases.If you continue to run the 1 pick up 2 lobe ignitionyou might get a 1-2HP gain (across the range), big adantage is tailoring your ignition to the engine.
For instance ditched a waisted spark setup , changed to 2 pick ups, 2 coils gained 4-6HP 3ft/lbs torq across the range, even better was

So......

1/Lighter flywheel no change in HP

2/ 2 pick up 2 coil 1 lobe arrangement with gain 3-4HP - but not readily available.

3/ "If you continue to run the 1 pick up 2 lobe ignitionyou might get a 1-2HP gain (across the range), big adantage is tailoring your ignition to the engine."

That is the Zeeltronic ignition with hand held tuner. Bearly noticeable HP improvement but maybe better response and/or fuel consumption with fine tuning??? Maybe better bottom end, top end and/or mid range with better (less compromised fixed timing) ignition tuning?

4/ "For instance ditched a waisted spark setup , changed to 2 pick ups, 2 coils gained 4-6HP 3ft/lbs torq across the range,.."

The best option but not readily available? Is it achievable? Is it easily achievable?

...... bad had untill 11,500 over rev

I will use mid range on the street and 11,500rpm performance is not on the radar.

[hybrid]

I have zeel on my LC, and the most noticeable difference was a MUCH better midrange, but the bike was better all over the range.

The LC has a lot more to gain than an RZ, because the LC has a flat ignition curve in it's CDI. Mine has not even been on the dyno... it's just using a curve I came up with after looking at a few different ones, so it's not even optimised right now.

IMO, $250 is more than worth it. Do it!


Oh, and I'm with Lozza... unless you want the wank factor of hearing your bike rev up faster when you're in neutral I wouldn't bother. More weight on the flywheel will get you off the line better anyway, and after that, the benefit of a light flywheel is negligible if any.

[2TInstitute]

When you see a small rotor on a flywheel what your not seeing is tha mass that was on the flywheel is added to the crank shaft, more mass on the flywheel gets better traction, and much easier to ride fast.

[OzzyElsie]

............ so it's not even optimised right now.

And how do you optimise the curve - trial and error, exchange info with others or put it on a dyno?

[2TInstitute]

All of the above.

[OzzyElsie]

All of the above.

Sounds like the $250-300 is the start not the finish.

How dependent are the settings on the individual configuration of the engine - capacity, carbs, chambers, compression, squish etc. Can you get a good setting with 'rule of thumb' universal setting?

[2TInstitute]

The whole idea of the programmable ignition is you tailor it to your engine.

[Jeram]

haha lozza


One thing I will say is that you can infact fit the 2 lobe setup into the stock cases.

What I did was purchased the 2strokeshop stator and flywheel set up. But I kept the pickups that they suplied which were too big so I had to modify my crank case side cover to fit them on the bike.

However, other people have said that if you swap the two aftermarket pickups for two RZ pickups, they are smaller and fit in the stock cases

[hybrid]

Sounds like the $250-300 is the start not the finish.

You're a glass half full kinda guy aren't you

You could look at it like I did - I'm more than happy with the performance vs cost right now and I could *possibly* get more out of it.
Right now, the cost vs benefit to go the next step doesn't fit for me as I have other priorities.

I'm happy to give you the curve I'm using if you decide to go ahead, and I'm sure you'd be happy to leave it with that.

As I said.. with the LC having a 20 degree (I think) flat curve, from factory you're optimised in a small part of the curve. It's easy to get gains over that.

If you're going to go to the expense of a dyno, you'd do it once ALL you mods are complete, and then the cost starts to make a bit more sense.

[OzzyElsie]

I'm sorry I asked.

[2TInstitute]

How can help you if your not prepared to listen and get the shits when you don't get the answers you wanted to hear ?